Before Bulk: Put This 9 in Hall First
TOWER GROVE — When baseball anthropologists exhume this point in history, carbon dating will show the steroid era transitioning into the straw-poll era.
It’s already started.
Before anyone could finish the second 100 pages of former Senator George Mitchell’s massive volume, reporters were cold-calling their peers for thoughts on the Hall of Fame voting. ESPN.com had a rundown on thoughts from voters, and its poll concluded that Roger Clemens – whose Cooperstown-bound career takes the Mitchell report like a clean shot to the … well, you know — would get only 36 percent of the vote with a hearty 40 percent undecided. Only Mark McGwire knows the math better: For every vote against his Hall cred, Clemens needs three votes for to gain induction.
San Francisco columnist Ray Ratto has always said it best: The National Baseball Hall of Fame isn’t a church. And, Hall of Fame pitcher Bob Feller told The Associated Press that he has a suggestion:
“You know what I think?” the renowned right-hander said. “I think there should be two Hall of Fames. One for drug losers and one for non-drug losers.”
I have not put in enough time to be a Hall of Fame voter, and I look at that right as not only a tremendous honor but a responsibility. My feelings on these players are different than other baseball writers, but they have a vote and I don’t so that’s that. Yet, before these steroid-dipped sluggers and hurlers with their questionable numbers and tarnished legacies reach Cooperstown, here are nine players who should get their first.
THE LINEUP: The Non-Muddied Nine
Or, nine players who should go into the National Baseball Hall of Fame before any of the uncertain stars of the steroid era do.
His absence from Cooperstown confounds me. Hall of Fame writer Leonard Koppett wrote that Gordon was “the most acrobatic second baseman of his or any other day.” He’s a nine-time All-Star who won four World Series titles with the New York Yankees. That team manufactured Hall of Famers, yet Gordon has yet to gain admittance. Possibly because his death came before a real strong movement could be hatched to get him into the Hall. In addition to being superb defensively, he hit, too. He averaged 26 home runs and 101 RBIs per season over 11 seasons. In 1942, he trumped Ted Williams and won the MVP. Oh, and in case you want to dismiss his titles as a Bronx mirage: He went to Cleveland in 1948, hit 32 homers, drove in 124 runs and took the Indians to the title. He’s the very definition of Hall of Famer. Tell me you don’t look at those names listed as comparisons on his Baseball-Reference.com page (linked above) and groan a little …
The new bench coach for the Milwaukee Brewers and his Cooperstown qualifications are well-known around these parts. So simply, I’ll borrow from Bill James’ book, Whatever Happened to the Hall of Fame? Simmons is mentioned in the same company as Cap Anson, Stan Musial, Ty Cobb, George Brett and Honus Wagner. They all had the most hits at their position. Simmons did too, with 2,472. (He also had more doubles than any catcher.) They are all in the Hall of Fame. Simmons should be too.
In 1993, Murphy signed with the Colorado Rockies needing two home runs to reach the mystic 400-homer milestone. He left Colorado to retire still needing those two. The book Leveling the Field – a fascinating attempt to equalize statistics as if players were swinging in the same conditions — pegs Murphy’s adjusted HR total to 504, if he was playing under modern conditions. His bronze would be up already. It’s difficult to know if those two homers is what’s keeping him out of the Hall of Fame, but he’s one of only two Hall-eligible players to have won two MVPs and not be in Cooperstown. (The other is mentioned later.) Murphy won five Gold Glove and was unanimously regarded as one of the finest fielders — if not the finest players — of his era. Moreover, his reputation as a player is only surpassed by his reputation as a person. He was a gentleman ballplayer. Murphy sounded off on the Mitchell Report today, and in response to a epidemic of PEDs he said he didn’t speak out about as a player, he founded “I Won’t Cheat” to stress to young athletes that it’s not only dangerous to use steroids but ethically wrong. Enough said.
(Ed. note: If you’re interested in more from Leveling the Field, I can work up a blog on it. Reggie Jackson, for example, would have 729 career homers. Maury Wills stole 180 bases in 1962.)
Like Murphy and Jim Rice, Dawson fits the Hall criteria for many voters: He was the best at his position, or even the best in the game, for a stretch of his career. Toiling in Montreal, Dawson was a three-time All-Star and a three-time Silver Slugger winner for the Expos. Twice as an Expo he finished second in the MVP voting, and he was a top-10 finisher three times while in Montreal. When he found the national spotlight finally as a Cub, all he did was win an MVP for a sixth-place team. He had eight gold gloves, 438 homers and 1,591 RBIs. The only players with more RBIs than Dawson are either already in the Hall, still active, Harold Baines or Rafael Palmeiro.
Sure the fact he was born in St. Louis helps get him on this list (he moved when he was 8), but have you ever looked at his numbers? No, really looked. He and Jimmy Ryan are the only players to rank in the top 35 for career runs scored and not be in the Hall of Fame. “Rip” had a career batting average of .316 to go with 1,639 runs, 2,532 hits and 583 stolen bases. The best argument against his Hall call is that he only lead the league in a significant category once, when he stole 45 bases in 1900. Again, we can got back to Leveling the Field to see that Van Haltren would have been a high dollar player in his day — averaging $12.6 million salary and scoring 99 runs a year to go with his .311 average. Don’t buy that statistical voodoo? Check his comparables according to Baseball-Reference.com: Eight of the 10 are already in the Hall, and a ninth (Ryan) probably should be as well.
No need to belabor his absence from Cooperstown. He’s the class of this year’s ballot and almost certain election. The going belief is that Bruce Sutter opened the door for closers to get into the Hall of Fame and Gossage would be shortly behind him through the opening. The first-ballot anointment of Cal Ripken Jr. and Tony Gwynn is the only thing that could delay the elite reliever who had 310 career saves and will probably start signing his name with an HOF ‘08 in the near future. Consider what Daily News baseball scribe Bill Madden wrote recently:
With 71.2% of the vote last year, the highest percentage of anyone not elected, Gossage - who was as dominant and fearsome as any closer ever - can be heartened by the fact that no candidate has ever received 70% and not been elected the next year.
7. MARVIN MILLER
As many reports around the country pointed out that the first time the late Bowie Kuhn defeated Marvin Miller was the last time they met as rivals — on the Hall of Fame ballot. Kuhn was recently elected to Cooperstown by a vote of the new veterans committee, yet Miller, who changed baseball forever, did not receive enough votes. Current union chief Don Fehr released a statement that said the vote was unfortunate and the Hall is “poorer for it”. He said:
“Over the entire scope of the last half of the 20th century, no other individual had as much influence on the game of baseball as did Marvin Miller, because he was the players’ voice, and represented them vigorously, Marvin Miller was the owners’ adversary. This time around, a majority of those voting were owner representatives, and results of the vote demonstrate the effect that had.”
Miller told Curt Flood he didn’t have a chance to save his career, but he could save others. Miller went with Flood to the fateful players’ meeting when Flood suggested he reject the trade and fight for free agency. Miller shepherded that future into reality. He even wrote a book about his time at the head of the union and put the perfect title for how he left the sport: A Whole Different Ball Game. Author John Helyar, whose book Lords of the Realm is a must-read, had this scathing article about the lack of votes for Miller. Miller himself had a fitting response, according to AP: “That figures.”
A sketch of him is over my desk here, so take this for what’s it worth. Jackson has the numbers (only two players have a higher career average) and the legendary career to be in the Hall. Old news. What the Mitchell Report has reminded all of us is this: Jackson and the other Black Sox have a “lifetime ban” — that’s what mars their place in history. Their names aren’t immortal, their punishment is. Can we say the same thing for players in the steroid era? Ninety years from now, will the Mitchell Report or BALCO or McGwire’s St. Patrick’s Day Clam-Up carry the same permanence as Judge Kenesaw Mountain Landis’ lifetime ban of “Shoeless” Joe? Jackson will still be banned. What will Barry Bonds be?
The Hall of Fame is not run by Major League Baseball. It cooperates with MLB. It cherishes its affiliation with MLB. But it is not governed by or beholden to MLB. It chooses its voters, just like it chooses how it honors players. Jackson belongs in. Just as Landis’ unilateral ruling to ban him belongs on the plaque right by his stats.
Like Murphy, Maris has two MVPs and is not in the Hall of Fame. All of the others player with two or more MVPs are active or Juan Gonzalez. Tell me that the last three years of coverage of the last 10 years of baseball have not forever altered your view of that home run record. It took the entire history of major-league baseball up to the year 1961 for someone to hit 61 home runs in a season, any season. From 1998 until 2001, it happened six times. Sammy Sosa did it three times — yet he never led the league in homers in any of those three seasons.
Sen. Jim Bunning called for the record books to be rewritten. Kuhn told me in spring 2006 that Bud Selig should break out the red pencil and hack away at the stats from this era. All that seems a little extreme and messy. In this jumbled hamper, how do you determine the dirty numbers from the clean? No, the best thing to happen is for there to be an asterisk beside Maris’ name in the record books. At the bottom of the page it should read:
* Hall of Famer.
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Kris Benson is scheduled to throw today in Phoenix for scouts from about a dozen teams, according to various report. The Cardinals plan to have a scout (Marty Keough) on hand to see the free-agent pitcher. Benson missed the 2007 season because of a torn labrum that has been surgically repaired.
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What I learned from the Mitchell Report, I already knew: Ken Griffey Jr. is one heckuva of a player.
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Derrick Goold said he was going to Mizzou for capital-J journalism, but after growing up in the Time Zone Baseball Forgot he was really drawn to MU sitting between two major-league cities. Goold joined the Post-Dispatch in 2001 after working for The Times-Picayune and Rocky Mountain News, covering sports from LSU to NHL and every level of baseball in between. 
Derrick
No argument about any of your nine, especially Simba, my favorite Cardinal in the 70’s. But if you include Shoeless Joe, why not Pete Rose?? Both are on the outside because of “gambling” issues.
I agree with all of the gentlemen you mentioned but I would also like to add Bert Blyleven. He ranks high amongst other from that era who are in the Hall in terms of wins, strike outs, ERA, shutouts–all of the key stats for a starter.
I agree with you on most of this Derrick. Blyleven should be in there, too. As for the other guy, who posted Rose….. Just like Jackson, he has a “lifetime” ban from baseball. Let Joe in now, he’s dead. You don’t let Pete into the HOF till the summer AFTER he passes away. A lifetime ban should be just that, lifetime, not a forever ban.
You know what no-one has mentioned is that Sammy Sosa does not appear on Mitchells report either. Hmmmmm, should Sammy be the official bearer of the single season homerun record.
Shoeless Joe made a deal to accept the ban based upon the results of his gambling trial. He was acquitted and Landis went back on his word and never lifted the ban. Joe should be in.
Enjoyable read. I have to admit that I have never understood the Roger Maris talk for the Hall. He certainly had one remarkable season and a couple other very good ones but that is not enough. His career numbers don’t even approach Hall of Fame standards. He wasn’t consistent and didn’t dominate long enough.
I disagree with the Marvin Miller entry. The player union is one of the reasons we’re in the ’steroids” era. It took us from one group of self interested rich individuals to two! When you become self interested to the degree where you are earning millions of dollars for mediocrity, you no longer care about integrity…just the almighty dollar. With the minimum salary now above $400,000, few play the game for the love of the game and now it’s showing.
Simba YES!!!!!!!!! Crime that Bench, Carter and Fisk are in but Simmons isnt.
How can you forget Buck O’Neill?
I want to hear the Teddy Bear song at Simba’s induction.
Pops,
The Hall of Fame is putting Buck O’Neil in — though it’s several years too late. O’Neil should have gone during his lifetime. Few in the history of the game have been as cherished and wonderful ambassador the game as O’Neill.
As for Pete Rose: Same rule applies. Put on his plaque that he was banned from participating in the game because he bet on the game and his plaque should hang.
A colleague of mine feels the same way as Matt2373 — that Maris’ induction into the Hall of Fame opens the way for others. That if Maris is in, then some of his comps come in. Jay Buhner, my colleague pointed out. Jesse Barfield. The debate on Jim Edmonds would be over. I disagree. Maris did what those others did not. He made history. There should be a consideration for changing the game, ala Ruth, ala Flood, ala Minoso, ala Maris. And so on.
A point that should be made that wasn’t in the blog: Many voters have had their chance to induct Maris … and chose not to. That should be acknowledged.
Don’t have to agree with it. But I do have to mention it.
dg
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Derrick,
Your arguments about Joe Gordon are very compelling. He sounds like Jeff Kent or Bobby Grich, generations earlier. He certainly was an impact, power bat, decades before you got that kind of production very often from second base. If he was a dazzling fielder, combined with contributing to many winning teams, it should be an open and shut case. He was apparently the first AL second baseman to hit at least 20 home runs in a season, reaching that mark seven times, and held the AL single-season record until 2001.
At risk of offending the stat-heads, one of the joys of baseball is the narrative side, and Gordon’s baseball-reference.com page contains the following gem: “August 3, 1960: Traded by the Cleveland Indians to the Detroit Tigers for Jimmie Dykes.” This was apparently the only trade of managers in major league history, according to Wikipedia (yeah, yeah, I was in a hurry). Gordon was also the first manager of the expansion KC Royals.
Shoeless Joe Jackson is dead, isn’t he? So wouldn’t a lifetime ban have expired? It wasn’t an eternal ban; he should be in and there should really be no debate. He paid a price.
I spend too much of my day on baseballreference.com and I took a second look at Steve Garvey. When you all get a chance, take a look at his stats. He seems very overlooked for HOF status. He had over 2500 hits, 10 time all star, former MVP, four time gold glove winner as well as a monster in the postseason with a .338 career batting average. What kept him out???
Not sure I follow you on the Griffey thing, Derrick. Griffey wasn’t mentioned in the book report– what does that prove?
Pip,
He wasn’t in the report. He had a legendary career derailed by injuries … and he’s still putting up incredible, Cooperstown-bound, elite numbers. He stood out in an era when others were artificially inflating themselves and their numbers, making it more difficult for the true stars to shine above the masses. And, yet, still Griffey did.
Could be an uncomfortable podium when he goes in with a few of his contemporaries.
dg
P.S. I’ll see if I can find a good explanation on Garvey and get back to you Matt2373.
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DG,
I feel the same way with Griffey. I am hopeful that history will look back on this era and people like Griffey and Maddux will stand out as the truly great players they were. Those are the guys that kids should be looking up to and those are the guys that fans should applaud. I hope Ken can stick around for a few more years.
Thanks in advance for looking into the Garvey comment. I just happened to look at his stat line and it just suprised me. I didn’t realize that he was that good.
Matt
I don’t know the minutia of the Black Sox scandal well enough to weigh Jackson’s culpability. I can see the logic of letting in Shoeless Joe and Pete Rose after their deaths. I’m not opposed. But I remain strongly opposed to Rose while he’s alive, and I have a problem with talking about the gamblers and fixers in the same debate as performance-enhancing drugs. I’ve had this argument on a regular basis with Rose supporters (every season, the message board for my fantasy football league devolves into “at least Charlie Hustle respected the game and didn’t use steroids”). There is a vast, qualitative difference between cheating to perform better and the specter of cheating to lose. There has been a sign about the ban on gambling on baseball posted in every major league locker room for almost 90 years, but Selig didn’t ban steroids until 2003 or start testing until 2004. It’s like the difference between throwing spit balls and pro wrestling. One is cheating, the other is fixed.
Dave - when the owners run MLB “for the love of the game”, then you’ve got a point. If they want to knock a zero off of ticket prices, merch prices, concessions, cable fees, and player salaries alike, great. Until then, the players deserve a fair share of all the money people pay to watch them. Nobody’s buying season tickets to watch Bill DeWitt. Marvin Miller should definitely be in the Hall of Fame.
Did I miss something? How are you guys so certain that Griffey and Maddux are clean?
Your Bill Madden must have forgotten about Nellie Fox in the mid-1980’s. Fox got over 74% of the vote–in his last year of eligibility. He had to wait until the Veteran’s Committee could vote him in.
One reason for Greg Maddux to be 100% clean was that he never looked any stronger than an accountant, pitched a finesse style, and his best years came in his prime, instead of his late 30’s/early 40’s, ala Clemens/Bonds.
As for Ken Griffey Jr., the fact that he hasn’t found himself into the supposed “witch hunt” makes a strong case against race card drawers who insist that the Barry Bonds public animosity comes from racism.
Derrick:
Shoeless Joe cheated and he lied under oath to cover it up. Since you quoted Bill James in support of Ted Simmons, I’ll quote Bill James from the Historical Baseball Abstract in opposition to Jackson: “When every honest ballplayer who has ever played the game, at any level from Babe Ruth ball through the majors, when every coach, writer, umpire and organist who has helped to make baseball the wonderful game that it is rather than trying to destroy it with the poison of deceit, when each has been given his due, then I think we should hold our noses and make room for Joe Jackson to join the Hall of Fame”.
I have never heard or read one tiny bit of mention that Maddux or Griffey have used roids or HGH. They are not linked to any lab or bat boy or report. So I will view their accomplishments as real and I will applaud them for it.
Wow, this was refreshing Derrick! Some good baseball talk. Yep, I agree with all your picks. It’s a shame those early 20th century folks have never made it much less even been nominated or honorable mentions. Your choice of Joe Jackson really got my attention and I am in 100% in agreement with that choice. Joe was done wrong. No one knows the dangers he may have been in if he had spoke up. He just kept quiet and and played the game to win. My gosh it must have been hard on him to play to win, while knowing some of his teammates were not, and maybe dealing with other issues that we will never know. Simba’s defense behind the plate and throwing arm while playing on teams that were not all that competitive hurt his chances. I’d like to get the opinions of the players of his era though. I’ll bet they would agree he belongs. He was a very smart baseball player who knew the game and helped him be the great hitter that he was. Unfortunately baseball smarts is an intangible that is hard to measure in a stat.
Will Marty Marrion have any more chances to get in the hall? It is a shame that Baseball fans, even in St Louis, don’t seem to have an appreciation for the gold glove and MVP performance of “Slats” in those great Cardinal glory years of the 40’s. For starters, how about an article about Marty’s contribution to baseball to remind Cardinal fans about this important part of our baseball history. Thanks!
I’m having trouble defining criteria for admittance to the HOF. The HOF should be for on-field accomplishment. Rose belongs. Now, I know Mantle and many others used amphetamines(greenies) to get over hangovers, but roids and HGH have gone too far. Great article on the “9″. I agree….all should be in. Add Blyleven, too.
The HOF is as plagued by politics and favoritism and prejudice, as are other sports. J JACKSON is not in, yet a raging alcoholic, violent biggots and other morally depraved monstrosities are. Through selective history we forget that the above mentioned displayed many of their worst acts as humans while on the FIELD!!!
So go ahead and defend his pompousness, Judge Landis, for his blind ignorance and harsh ruling, yet laud Ty Cobb and others that shamed themselves ON AND OFF the field.Such hypocrisy is why the HOF does not now, nor has it ever included the best in the game…
I believe there has been some confusion in the Cardinal’s front office. It appears as if their plans for attracting locals to the ballpark have been mixed up with their player acquisition strategies.
Do the owners really think that by acquiring a number of kids with local roots that the fans wouldn’t notice that the quality of the product is steadily declining?
True, Ken Griffey Jr. is one heck of a ballplayer, and so was Pete Rose.