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08.03.2008 1:20 am

Name the Cardinals’ All-Time 3 Stars

St. Louis Post-Dispatch
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DOWNTOWN — Back in my early days at the P-D covering hockey, the selection of the “Three Stars” at each game was, loosely, my responsibility. Toward the end of the game, a quick straw poll was taken of the other writers in the box. Sometimes the selections were obvious. Sometimes they weren’t. Sometimes they drew compliments. A few times they sparked debate. My name was on the box score, so I took it seriously.

(Ask Chris Kerber about Jean-Sebastien Giguere sometime.)

Tonight ESPN takes hockey’s “Three Star” tradition and applies it to baseball, with a broader, historic range of candidates.

According to a paragraph in Saturday’s Cardinals’ games notes, ESPN’s Baseball Tonight’s panel of experts will begin a monthlong debate on the “top three players all-time for each francise.” The discussion begins tonight and as prelude to the Cardinals-Phillies telecast from Busch Stadium, the Cardinals are the first to get the three-star treatment.

A poll of fans conducted at ESPN.com will help augment the experts’ selections.

But why wait?

During Saturday’s game, we kicked around the three-star concept. Would Evan Longoria already rank in Tampa Bay’s Fab 3? Certainly Carl Crawford is No. 1. How do you pick three New York Yankees? I mean after Babe Ruth and Lou Gehrig, that is. Is there a modern player who will crack the top-three lists of the historic franchises — the 18 who were around in 1961, for example? Two candidates: Barry Bonds, obviously, and, in LA, Mike Piazza.

To settle on a Cardinals’ “Three Stars”, we started on the wall.

Out in left field at Busch Stadium, there’s a good shortlist of candidates for the top-three list: They are the retired numbers. With Ducky Medwick and Albert Pujols as, arguably, the only exceptions, the retired numbers will provide the Cardinals’ top three. They are:

1 — Ozzie Smith … 2 — Red Schoendienst … 6 — Stan Musial … 9 — Enos Slaughter … 14 — Ken Boyer … 17 — Dizzy Dean … 20 — Lou Brock … 42 — Bruce Sutter … 45 — Bob Gibson. … STL — Rogers Hornsby.

This is the starting place for any ranking of the top three all-time players in Cardinals history. The online poll is likely to reflect its times, heavily weighing toward modern players or living legends. That said, as Hall of Famer  Rick Hummel and I discussed the “Three Stars” from Cardinals’ history and wondered who should skate away with those honors, there appeared to be two locks and a few candidates for No. 3.

Offer up yours in the comment area below. Mine? Mine:

  1. Musial
  2. Gibson
  3. Hornsby

-30-

136 comments

Comments are closed.

Top three has got to include Musial and Gibson and after that number three boils down to either Ozzie or Albert.

— Dave
8:34 am August 3rd, 2008

Musial, Hornsby, Gibson

— Leo Fontanella
8:47 am August 3rd, 2008

DG,

Hornsby, Musial and Gibby are the top selections (not in that order). I don’t think there is any question. To have seen 2 of the 3 greatest Cardinals play in 3 Busch Stadiums has been a privilege. Albert may earn his way onto this list but he has quite a few years to go.

— MTBleedRed18
8:49 am August 3rd, 2008

In a slam dunk I have to agree with you DG. The Players you picked came to mind when I first started reading your article. In fairness to the players of the dead ball era I had to cast a vote toward Hornsby for the third slot. He led the Cards to their first World Series title in 1926. He was Branch Ricky’s first defining gem of a player.

Musial has to be number one for so many reasons. But to make this brief how about the well known fact that Stan the Man was a Cardinal his entire career and played in 24 ALLSTAR games during his HOF 22 year career.

I cast my second vote for Bob Gibson. He also played his entire career in St. Louis. His Hall of Fame feats are many also. But my gosh we BIRD LAND birds all should know what a fearsome competitor Gibby was. I loved his attitude with ball players from the other team. He treated them as an enemy. No fraternizing with the other side. Also, when he took the ball he was not looking for bullpen help to get him a win. He planned on pitching NINE every game. Another era gone by. I miss that era so much. The love of money has taken much of the flavor out of the game.

But here they are in Bird Land pecking order:

Stan “the Man” Musial
Bob Gibson
Rogers Hornsby

Very special mention to Lou Brock AND Ozzie Smith. We’ll see where Pujols lands when his career is over. Hopefully the HOF will have number 5 landing in it one day wearing the Birds on the Bat also.

— drelboc
9:14 am August 3rd, 2008

There are clearly five players on this list. Musial is automatic. Gibson, Hornsby, Ozzie and Pujols are the other four. It’s a tough cut down to three. Gibby seems obvious, but you can make a case for Hornsby and Pujols instead. It’s the impossible argument of pitchers vs. hitters. Ozzie is probably the easiest (yet difficult) cut of the five, which tells you what a tough list it is.

Even without projecting anything, in a career of eight season, I think you have to include Albert. He already brings almost everything to the table that the other top candidates have.

– Leader of the team in an era that includes a World Championship and post season in five of seven seasons.
– Offensive monster. No need to preach to the choir on this one.
– Gold glover. Won the award in only his third full season at first base, which must be something close to unprecedented. (Aside: Thinking of otheres winning GGs at new positions, Mark Grudzielanek won it in KC in his seventh season at 2B.)
– Highly decorated career. 1 MVP (should be two, maybe three), 1 GG, rookie of the year, batting title.

The only thing lacking for Albert is longevity, if eight years isn’t good enough for you. Hornsby had “only” 11 full seasons in St. Louis, leaving at age 30. It’s no knock on the Rajah, but he only played part of his best seasons in St. Louis, so that’s one reason to favor the others. I would rather list five, but if it has to be three:

Musial
Pujols
Gibson

— Fuhrig
9:16 am August 3rd, 2008

1. Musial
2. Gibson
3. Ozzie
3A. Brock

— Dan
9:18 am August 3rd, 2008

Right now is has to be:

Musial Gibson Hornsby

You can’t put Albert on their just yet. He will likely end up on their and may crack into the top two, or even the top. But we have to wait until his numbers flesh out.

Hornsby was player/manager of our first World Title team. He hit over .400 a few times. He was the inspiration for Ted Williams hitting style.

I think you also have to take championships into account. Part of what makes Musial so fantastic is not that he was our best hitter, but that he had the most successful run as our star player. Let’s hope Albert will give Stan a run for his money ;-)

— RCJ
9:26 am August 3rd, 2008

It is difficult, indeed, to pick only three. Musial is a lock, of course, and it would be impossible to argue with Gibson. But who is number 3? A case can be made for most of those others have chosen, so it is more a matter of deciding who to leave off. In my list, I drop Hornsby and Ozzie as they both had part of their career elsewhere. If Carlton had stayed longer with the Cardinals, he would fit that description as well. One name I haven’t seen but who, I believe, deserves mention is Curt Flood. He remains my all-time favorite Cardinal center fielder, but doesn’t make my top three. Only injury keeps Dizzy off the list. My pick for right now is Lou Brock at number 3. But my prediction is that in another 10 years, number three will go to big number 5, Albert Pujols. So:

1. Musial
2. Gibson
3. Brock (until 2018, then Pujols)

— E. C. Walker
9:33 am August 3rd, 2008

Musial and Gibson are the obvious top two. Not counting Albert yet, the number 3 slot is a bit tougher and more open to personal choice. The 80’s were my favorite Cardinal era and Ozzie was my favorite player so I am going with him for the number 3 slot. Hard for me to leave out Lou as he was my favorite 70’s era player.

— LandShark
9:43 am August 3rd, 2008

Who else could it be. Gibby is one of the best pitchers ever. And Stan the Man, Mr. Cardinal. Hornsby is the name anyone who knows Cardinal Baseball would name. Good call

— Janice Holland
9:46 am August 3rd, 2008

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