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11.26.2008 12:25 pm

PostCards: Who manages the St. Louis Cardinals in 2010?

St. Louis Post-Dispatch
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TOWER GROVE — In this crowded field of mailbags and Q&As and message boards and chats and blogs there are only so many questions about Skip Schumaker playing second base to fuel so many different give-and-take platforms. Good thing PostCards has Frank Fuhrig.

The mailbag was loaded with questions answered better elsewhere or answered often before, but on election day into the hopper Fuhrig fired this gem: Who manages the St. Louis Cardinals in 2010?

The poll is below.

This next season is the final season of manager Tony La Russa’s contract with the club, and he has given no indication that he plans for it to be his last. Though, it’s not his style to announce such things early in the game. La Russa will undoubtedly do what La Russa has always done, most recently after the draining season of 2007 — he’ll decide if he still has the drive after the season is finished. It would be foolish for the Cardinals not to at least construct a short list of options in case La Russa decides to walk away. Already there are a few candidates in the wings — Jose Oquendo, the club’s third-base coach for the past decade, and rising manager prospect Ron “Pop” Warner, the team’s Double-A manager.

Manager-in-Waiting?

Jose Oquendo: Manager-in-Waiting?

Colleague Joe Strauss visited with Oquendo in Puerto Rico this past week and wrote about Oquendo’s future and his wishes to manage. Oquendo’s name is on the radar for major-league manager openings now. He’s interviewed in Seattle this winter and interview a few winters ago in San Diego. Getting considered for such jobs puts his name in circulation, and that’s part of the process of landing a gig for a first-time manager. He also has the appeal locally of being a bridge manager — someone who played for Whitey Herzog and worked for La Russa. He also has a working relationship with Dave Duncan, who will have an intriguing decision to make if La Russa decides to head west, for good.

And that’s a big if.

But it’s a fine place to start a mailbag. On with PostCards.

***

Q: PoliSci guy, here’s an idea to use your snazzy polling capabilities: A successor when Tony La Russa’s current term expires after 2009. OK, so it’s a long transition period: that’s just how the Consti… um, contract is written. Who should be Cardinals manager in 2010, to lead the team over a bridge to the 21st century’s second decade.

Some candidates: Tony La Russa, Democrat. Platform: A hard nine, animal rights, don’t change horses in mid-stream (Nod to “WAG the dog”), endorsed by Albert Pujols. … Jose Oquendo, bidding to be the first Latin American skipper in the Redbirds dugout. Platform: Another term for LaRussa? Or Whitey Herzog? … Joe Maddon, platform: A candidate for change to a player development model. … Pop Warner. … Don Mattingly?

DG: Seems like a good poll to start the holidays, because really Fuhrig’s question is more about who you wish will follow La Russa into the manager’s office and not necessarily who will. Wishes are part of this season. A lot can happen between now and La Russa volunteering to step away from the Cardinals’ dugout. There are some obvious in-house candidates and there are certain to be some less-obvious outside candidates (Willie Randolph? Jim Leyland?).

In constructing this poll for the readers, I used Fuhrig’s suggested ballot of candidates:

The Cardinals’ manager in 2010

View Results

Loading ... Loading …

***

Q: Thanks for taking my question. What happens to a free agent that is type A or B that does not sign with a team until after the June draft? Does the team the player left miss out on draft picks or are the compensated in the following years draft? I think this happened with Roger Clemens a couple of years ago when he signed with the Yankees.

Jeff F.

DG: First, the Clemens situation. Clemens made his dramatic announcement at Yankee Stadium in May 2007, so he did sign before the draft. Though he was a Type A free agent, there would be no compensation because Houston didn’t offer him arbitration. That’s usually the key. Second, a brief crash course on how the compensation works:

  • Players are assigned a type, and Type A and Type B free agents net compensation.
  • The player must be signed before Dec. 1 or offered arbitration by former team.
  • A Type A player that signs with another team means his former team gets the signing team’s first-round pick and an additional “sandwich” pick.
  • A Type B player costs the signing team nothing, but gains the former team a “sandwich” pick.
  • New to the current CBA is the top 15 picks in the draft are protected from this, and the signing team with a top-15 pick would surrender a second-round pick for a Type A free agent. (In 2009, the top 16 picks are protected because Washington didn’t sign Mizzou pitcher Aaron Crow.)

Now to the question. What happens if a Type A or Type B signs after that next summer’s draft? Given that the player was offered arbitration and rejected the offer, it seems natural that compensation of some kind would be awarded. The Collective Bargaining Agreement is less than clear on this possibility (stunning, I know). But there is a telling statement on Page 73 of the CBA that states compensation for lost free agents “shall be awarded in the Major League Rule 4 Draft succeeding the Player’s election of free agency.”

A strict interpretation of that phrase says a team is due compensation the draft immediately following the player’s choice to become a free agent — not immediately following the player actually signing a deal with a different team. I have emails in to people for clarification. But I think that sentence says it all. It’s compensation in the next summer’s draft or there’s no compensation.

***

Low-Hanging Fruit?

Free Agent SS Nick Punto: "Low-Hanging Fruit"?

Q: All the “big player” teams (Yankees, Red Sox, Mets, Angels, Rangers, Dodgers, Cubs, Brewers, etc) have their golden horses at the starting line ready and itching at the bit to start the FA race and grab up most the winnings while the leaving the rest of the pack to scramble for the crumbs they leave behind. When their dust settles, do you think there will be any crumbs worth while to pick up?

David O. Cobler, Topeka, Kan.

DG: There will be. This is a particularly deep free-agent class, especially when it comes to starting pitchers, and the economy seems to have put a chill on the spending spree for the middle-tier free agents. There is also an overheated trade market, especially as teams try to land cost-effective starting pitching. All of that leaves plenty of options for a team on the prowl for low-hanging fruit …

Sorry, it was just too easy.

… Not all of the “dust-settle” free agents are going to fill Cardinals’ needs, but some will. A quick list of free agents who will be in the second or third wave of signings, some of whom obviously will draw the Cardinals’ attention: RP Bob Howry, SP Jason Jennings, SP Randy Johnson (Cardinals are on his list), UT Mark Loretta (not a bad option at second base, worth re-exploring), RP Brandon Lyon (closed last season, Cards say they’d lean to go with one of the younger guys), SS Nick Punto (any appeal as starting shortstop for Cardinals?); SP Randy Wolf; RP Juan Cruz, though may draw more attention than any other player on this list.

***

Q: I’ve been meaning to ask this question for a while and I’m just getting around to it. What are the MLB rules around player options in terms of promoting minor leaguers and sending them back down? I always hear during the season about players that run out of options making player personnel decisions trickier for GMs. How does that work exactly?

Tim Catlett, St. Louis

DG: The nomenclature doesn’t help. Really they should always be referred to as “option years”, but that has just been shortened to “options.” I’ll use prospect Tyler Greene as an example to explain it. Greene was recently added to the 40-man roster on the first year he had to be added. That means he’ll come to spring training on the major-league roster. If he doesn’t make the team, Greene will have to be optioned to Triple-A. That triggers the first of his three “option years.” He can yo-yo between the majors and Triple-A all season long, wearing Interstate 55 if need be, and he’ll still only burn one option. The option covers the entire year. And he has three of them. They do not necessarily run three consecutive years — for example, Chris Perez could spend this entire season in the majors and still have two options left. Colby Rasmus could and still have three options left, as he has never been added to the 40-man roster. And so on.

Once a players option years runs out, like Brendan Ryan’s have, he must be passed through waivers to reach an assignment in the minors. Ryan, therefore, this spring is auditioning for all 30 teams.

***

Q: We’re doomed! Doomed!

Erma L.

DG: This may have been an email trying to sell me something or a Chicken Little chain letter floating through the newspaper industry. Not sure. But it came to PostCards. Hey, it is only Thanksgiving. Free agency has yet to really hit the shopping-spree season. There’s still plenty of time to fill holes. And, yes, there are some holes to fill.

***

Powered by questions, Q&As and chats, Post-Dispatch baseball writer Derrick Goold will answer fans’ emails in PostCards, a spin-off of Bird Land. To comment and discuss the mailbag visit the PostCards blog on StlToday.com. To submit questions write PostCards@post-dispatch.com or file them as a comment on this blog. With all questions please include your name and hometown.

Questions can also be asked at Bird Land @ Facebook (500 strong), or over at my “bird feed” on Twitter.

PostCards will run online exclusively at StlToday.com.

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26 comments

Comments are closed.

I think Pujols would be an intriguing choice as a player/ manager. The question is, does being a player/manager take more out of you? The season seems to take a toll on players and managers alike. Is todays game to much to put on a player/managers hat?

— dboc
2:48 pm November 26th, 2008

The media chores alone would make it all but impossible.

— Derrick Goold
4:06 pm November 26th, 2008

Post-LaRussa is really anyobdy’s game: I myself give the edge to post-Tigers Jimmy Leyland. Don’t discount former prominent Cards like Terry Pendleton (Ozzie bench coach?!), or even Andy Van Slyke.

— Doug
4:07 pm November 26th, 2008

Thanks for explaining the situation with compensatory draft picks. I still
have one other question though. What happens when a team (Yankees) sign more than one Type-A free agent? Do all the teams get 2 extra picks or do some of them have to be satisfied with just a sandwich pick? Does draft order or timing of the signing determine who gets the pick?

— Sailor Jay
11:24 pm November 26th, 2008

There are limits to how many picks a team gives up, because there is just the one first-round pick for teams to lose, in most cases. The sandwich picks help balance the ledger for teams whose compensation is altered by a team, like the Yankees, signing more a than a couple Type A free agents.

— Derrick Goold
11:29 am November 27th, 2008

I see I’m not the only one who remembered Terry Pendleton’s name as having floated out there before. Haven’t heard much the last year or so, though, about his being on anyone’s managerial short list - maybe his window of opportunity has already passed? Or is he being held back as the possible successor to Bobby Cox in Atlanta?

I’m not sure how effective Oquendo would be as manager; he seems like too much of a “nice guy”. I kind of wish he’d gotten the job in Seattle, though, because it would have opened up a spot on the major-league coaching staff for Warner, whose star seems to be rising in the organization.

OTOH, is St. Louis ready for another “Warner”?

— Jerry Modene
9:42 pm November 27th, 2008

Oquendo should obviously garner some serious votes and attention. Likewise, for Pop. I am intrigued and in agreement with not only developing player development but also in house management/executives who come up through the ranks. Just seems as if this allows individuals to learn and buy into the teams “philosophy” and execute in accordance to what the mission of the team is.

However, there are blatant scenarios where a need may need to be filled through outside resources, i.e. free agents (players), or outside management candidates (see 2007 offseason for GM replacement). With all that being stated, a candidate that I have always been intrigued by is former Cardinal 3B Terry Pendleton. He has been part of the coaching game (Atlanta hitting coach) and by all accounts is a knowledgable baseball man and leader. Add into the fact that he had a strong fanbase in his STL playing days and in my opinion you have a legit candidate. This is not to take away from Oquendo or Warner, but merely a strong name to throw into circulation. Comments?

— j strange
10:51 pm November 27th, 2008

Ahhhhh, I didn’t read comments before I posted; good call Jerry M. But, I digress. Opinions?

— j strange
10:56 pm November 27th, 2008

Well, another interesting point is that the Cards rarely go outside of their system to hire a manager - although the two most recent times they’ve done so, they wound up with two of the more successful managers they’ve ever had - Whitey Herzog and Tony La Russa.

Consider, as we go back 50 seasons:

Solly Hemus - player for the Cards, traded to Phils, hired as manager after he writes that letter to Gussie Busch.

Johnny Keane - long-time minor-league manager and coach with the Cards.

Red Schoendienst - long-time player, was a coach when he got the pilot’s job.

Vern Rapp - hired from the Denver Bears, but had managed several years for the Cards in their minor-league system.

Ken Boyer - long-time player and coach, was managing in AAA when the Cards hired him to replace Rapp.

Whitey Herzog - never played for or coached for the Cards, although he at least hailed from not-too-far-away.

Joe Torre - played five seasons with Cards. Hired out of Angels’ broadcast booth to replace Herzog.

Mike Jorgensen - interim manager, had played a year or two with Cards and was farm director, IIRC, when Torre was fired.

Tony La Russa - like Herzog, no real connection to the Cards, although he did play his final minor-league season with the Cards’ AAA franchise at New Orleans in 1977.

So - based on our track record - let’s not forget guys like Southworth and Street and Dyer and Marion and Walker too - it’s far more likely that we’ll hire TLR’s replacement from within the organization - but (adding Fred Hutchinson to the short list of “outsiders” hired to manage the Cards) if we do hire someone from outside, the odds are that he’ll be pretty darned successful; Hutch was our best manager of the 1950’s - admittedly that’s not saying much - and we already know Herzog and TLR’s accomplishments.

— Jerry Modene
3:29 am November 28th, 2008

Interesting topic, esp. after considering the same question last year. Great research by Jerry Modene, but how much can be concluded from that history? All of the hires were by A-B–most by Gussie himself.
The first trend I thought of was the opposite: the Cards’ recent history of hiring high-profile managers with (postseason) experience outside of the organization: La Russa, Torre, Herzog. (I don’t count Jorgensen, who if I recall was never considered a serious candidate for the permanent post. And didn’t the presence of Jocketty make La Russa a prohibitive favorite the day Torre was fired?) Ken Boyer, I believe, was the last Cards’ manager to enter the joy w/o previous ML managerial experience. Then again, based upon my own argument, there’s not a whole lot to conclude here. Regardless of anyone’s opinions about Bill DeWitt (pro or con), I wouldn’t want to hazard a guess of what a guy is going to do in two years when I’ve never seen him to it before.

— micus-va
1:40 pm November 28th, 2008

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