US must shake its Wild West attitude toward guns
In one bitter week, six dead in Kirkwood, MO and six in DeKalb, IL, an even dozen, from a fusillade of gunfire by two citizens armed and dangerous. This is not counting the other assorted incidents of victims killed by gun-toting citizens in our country last week alone.. I don’t have the exact number of deaths due to weapons legally obtained by the perpetrators. No doubt, that illustrious defender of the faith, ranting their spurious, self-serving interpretation of the Constitution of our right to bear arms, the NRA, keeps this total on their spreadsheets at Washington, DC. headquarters. In this hail of bullets members of this “militia” power-mad lobbying throng must be chanting, ” Hail to the NRA “. How many card-carrying members recited the Lords Prayer attending funerals of their slain friends?
Against an individuals intent on killing scores of others indiscriminately, the evidence is overwhelming that there is scant defense from limiting the initial carnage by officers of the law or average citizens, unarmed or armed with openly displayed or concealed weapons for defense. To those who defend the Missouri concealed-carry law I challenge each of them to be able to respond instantly and effectively to ongoing violence in a manner that would prevent the immediate bloodshed of others and their own imminent demise. At the very least law enforcement gets weapons training; most individuals have little more than rudimentary knowledge of weapons safety and use though they may like to think they are Cool Hand Luke with a fast draw.
Until we as a nation wake up from our 1870’s Wild West attitude toward guns, we will continue to witness these unspeakable, irrational killing rampages which compete for headline-grabbing attention with the daily slaughter of countless civilians and soldiers in Iraq and Afghanistan. Both are a consequence of active and wrong-headed decisions we have brought upon ourselves. The ownership of all handguns and assault weapons by other than the appropriate authorities should be banned. Will we still be ringing our hands and hurting as many more people inevitably are taken down by legal and illegal guns? It is one quick step away from a deranged or angered citizen from pulling the trigger upon you and yours. Welcome to Iraq in Missouri.
Laurence C. Day
Ladue
David H…I know statistics don’t matter to the gun-freaks, even if they’re from the CDC.
I hate posting this stuff…If you’re so educated in “basic math abilities,” why can’t you find the stats?
http://media.www.collegian.com/media/storage/paper864/news/2006/02/22/Opinion/Guns-Kill.People-1709520.shtml
Bb…you’re right. I protect my kids and have taught them to protect themselves…and we don’t have to be a bunch of hillbilly red-necks with guns to feel safe….Unfortunately, stray bullets don’t discriminate…Ask the students at the 43 high schools who avoided gunfire masacres while hiding under their desks….I fear for my children’s safety, just like their parents, because NRA gun-freaks think they have a constitutional right to hunt squirrrels every October.
Mrs Garrison, you used an OPINION piece as a source, and an old one at that.
While I respect Garrison’s views on guns, as he and I have had this conversation in the past, I generally disagree with him on this topic. Garrison’s view is that if there were laws created that would outlaw the production of guns now it would make for a better society in general down the road, say in a 100 years. A noble effort but realistically impractical when you look at it from a common sense perspective. Guns are already in our society and for the most part you could not gather them all up and dispose of them. How would you go about doing that? Explain EXACTLY how you would do that please?
Now remember you have to include all guns, including those law enforcement carry. Granted if the theory holds and all guns are eliminated, the cops would eventually not need guns. Until then guns will exist and if they exist there will always be ways for criminal elements who want one to get one. i.e. stealing, black market, etc. The economics of it all say if there is a demand then a supply will come from somewhere to meet that demand whether it is a legal or illegal source.
I take a practical view of guns in our society. I am a CCW permit holder who practices on a regular basis to the tune of 200-400 rounds per month. I take the responsibility to act and carry safely and it has not failed me to date.
I look at it like this. I live in the now. I recognize there are numerous elements in society who have no regard for life and are willing to kill in an instant. Without a way to defend myself against another person who has a gun, I’m left with no options except to fight back any way I can or just succumb to the inevitable. Some will say the odds on that happening are slim. Well it doesn’t really matter because the finality of it all is I can only die once. Do I want it to be at the end of a criminal’s gun going down without a fight or do I want every available resource I have at my disposal? The state of MO has given me and others, the legal ability to have the latter so I chose it. The cops cannot protect you every minute of every day and generally show up after the fact.
Garrison, if I’ve not relayed the general intent of your arguements agains guns please do so. If I remember right, you said at one time you were the military. If that is the case then I would really like to understand your why you think about weapons the way you do.
Sub Par…it’s an opinion piece about guns which uses factual CDC statistics. Try to seperate the two before you show your ignorance…The piece was written 2 years ago. The number of gun-related deaths in America has increased since then… despite more cowboys carrying concealed weapons.
AJ…To answer your first question…I’ve never proposed “gather-up” all guns and disposing of them…. Let’s reduce the production of handguns this year from 12 million to 11.75 million and continue to reduce production by 4% every year….In Guns will be as common as Model T Fords.
To answer your second question. I served in the military at the close of the Vietnam War. I’ve seen the destruction guns can do to the human body. Many ex-military hold the same opinions I hold…
Most of the 20 year old gun-freaks we’re hearing from today conceptualize the glory of guns with PlayStation 2.
Garrison,
The article you cited is an OPINION piece. It’s even filed that way. The statistics cited are spun -badly. Here is a link to the real CDC data:
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr55/nvsr55_19.pdf
Check out the top 15 list on page 8. Then move on to page 30-33, this table really shows the brass tacks of what kills people in the US. What you will quickly see is the OPINION piece you referenced only got it’s inflated figures by including SUICIDES. I emphasize this, because all the anti gunners do this.
Why? Because the real statistics show that gun crime is no where near as prevalent as the media makes it seem. It also allows them to make claims like “you are more likely to be harmed by a gun in your house than use it to defend yourself” – because they count Suicides! Of course the anti gunners ignore all the cases where guns stopped crime, prevented crime and saved lives.
PS- you will also discover that including assaults, accidents and “undetermined intent”, firearms killed, 7 children aged 0-1, 73 children aged 1-4, and 241 kids aged 5-14, for a total of 321. How did the anti gunners get the statistics you cited? They include 15-24 year olds as “children” - And – wait for it - included suicides. By the way, a quick perusal of the stats will also show that suicide by gun was not the method of choice for this age group.
Listen - and this applies to any debate you get in - you should never trust the rhetoric. Do your homework, and find and interpret the results yourself. You are fortunate to live in the US, where the government will share Obscene amounts of information with you. No matter the subject, from crime, death to taxes – it’s all there. Don’t take someone else’s predigested diatribe – find out for yourself. If you do, you might see that guns are no where near the threat you think they are, and they are used to help way more often than you have been led to believe.
Garrison,
Double your 20 year olds estimate and you’d be near my age.
Please answer my question however. How would you deal with the guns that are currently in our society today? Even if you stopped gun production now, what would you do with the ones in circulation which all have the ability to kill?
#15 David H: Every evolved society in history has seen specialization - meaning entrusting certain types of people to perform a certain role in society that are most skilled in that role. Even the modern day global behemoths, the holy bastions of Capitalism that you might cheer, excel in specialization. It is strange that security is something that we think should not be a specialized task in present day life. Coming back to the UK and Australia…
“In 2005/06 there were 766 offences initially recorded as homicide by the police in England and Wales (including the 52 victims of the 7 July 2005 London bombings),[17] a rate of 1.4 per 100,000 of population. Only 50 (6.6%) were committed with firearms, one being with an air weapon.[18] The homicide rate for London was 2.4 per 100,000 in the same year (1.7 when excluding the 7 July bombings).[19]
By comparison, 5.5 murders per 100,000 of population were reported by police in the United States in 2000, of which 70% involved the use of firearms.[20] New York City, with a population size similar to London (over 8 million residents), reported 6.9 murders per 100,000 people in 2004.”
Why must it be “concealed carry” why not revealed carry? I think you should only be able to carry a visiable fire arm.
The whole issue is about YOUR right to protect YOURSELF. So don’t give me that standard BS about “guns work best when the bad guys have to guess who is armed and who isn’t “. Why should I have to be part of your game? This is a monster you created.
The truth is, gun guys don’t want the whole world to know that they are too cowardly to walk out in public without a gun. As much as they would like to live in Dodge City circa 1850 they know they would look pretty silly walking around Chuck-E-Cheese circa 2007, with a gun strapped to their hip.
Garrison/BluePlanet,
Anybody can post a link to slanted statistics. I was referring to the inability of either of you to properly interpret what the statistics mean. Mr. Garrison inflates the number of killing of children with firearms by including suicides, individual up to age 24, and ignoring the fact that the vast majority of the killings are criminal gang member shooting one another. BluePlanet seems to not understand that many factors make up the crime rate of a country.
How about comparing the crime rate in the UK before and after the enactment of draconian gun laws? Murder is not the only crime committed. How about comparing rates of burglary when someone is at home in the UK to the USA? The rate is much higher in the UK because criminals know they are unlikely to face an unarmed intruder.
Mr. Garrison would do well to stop the ludicrous generalizations and personal attacks. I doubt very seriously that there are many 20 year old posting in this forum. For the record, I am a middle aged executive at a very large firm. I believe that I have been very charitable in placing the blame for his misinterpreting statistics on lack of education rather than malicious intent.