Catherine,

Great post
As a 3rd generation parishioner at St. Stanislaus it saddens me to see the abuse by our lawyer friend Burke and how he can run amuck and stain the faithful of this diocese

Today’s Post-Dispatch hidden on pg #8

“Archdiocese pays out $467,500 MORE over sexual abuse case”

Anyone wonder if $467,500 more, what is the total?

Anyone who has the gall to think AB Burkes fight with St. Stanislaus isn’t over money, greed and control need to get a grip.

Catherine,

As a parent, did you raise your children in such a way that allowed them to do anything they want whenever they wanted because they thought it was okay? I’m assuming that it is not the way you brought your children up.

When we are kids, we often want to dictate to those above us what is right and what is wrong based on our worldview. In most cases, we are wrong due to our lack of understanding, our immaturity, our pride, or our selfishness. I assume that in some point in your raising your family, you were probably forced to punish, ground, etc. your kids for something they did. My question is, did you not punish them out of love so that they would avoid the behavior that is detrimental to their development in the future? Most parents do not punish their kids out of malice or simply to prove they are the boss. They do it out of love. Your hope that your children learn what they have done wrong, apologize, reconcile, and grow from the experience.

This is no different than what Archbishop Burke did in the case of St. Stanislaus or Sr. Louise. Punishments such as interdict and excommunication are not mailicious, spiteful, or bully-esque acts. These sanctions are also not a knock against the individuals, just as you do not tell your children that they are intrinsically bad when you have to punish them. I’m sure that Archbishop Burke would say the same thing about Sr. Louise, that she has done wonderful things in her service of the Church, but that she made a mistake by attending the false ordination. These things are meant to serve as a sacramental “grounding” when we stray from what Christ and His Church know is best for our SPIRITUAL growth and development, which should be paramount to our lives. The desired result is not banishment, but reconciliation, if we are humble enough to admit that we may not always know what is best. Some people have chosen to scream, yell, spit, kick, call names, and throw a tantrum like the 5 year old who is corrected by his parents and still wants to have his way. But for us, just like the 5 year old, that behavior just means a greater spiritual rift that is created that takes us further away from Christ and reconciliation.

I encourage you to pray over this metaphor in relation to your situation at St. Cronan’s. It is certainly not an easy thing to experience, and it in no way accounts for your hurt over the Rigali situation. But it may help you come to a greater peace and maybe understanding about this situation.

Matt1618:

Your metaphor is on the mark, but not the way you think.

Adult Catholics should not be treated as children. Archbishop Burke never realized this.

I did not mean to imply that Catholic adults need to be treated as children. I simply was conveying the point that just because we are adults and supposedly mature and logical thinkers, does not mean that we are free from erring in our judgement and straying from the path to holiness that Christ wants us to walk. As adults, we need people to keep us in check. It doesn’t mean we should be treated as immature or stupid, just that we are capable of being wrong. Those in the Magisterium of the Church, though just as capable of sinfulness as time has proven, are put in the position to lead us to a right relationship with God, thus they are the ones charged with keeping us in check. Just because someone has the ability to issue liturgical sanctions does not mean that they are treating us as inferior or like children in any way. It is a call for us to reconcile and to grow spiritually.

The parent metaphor serves simply as a way of understanding the ROLE of a bishop within the Church, not as a way to describe the relationship between the bishop and the faithful.

Matt,

Excellent post. Your parent/child metaphor is perfectly appropriate and is a device that Jesus himself used often. In fact, God the Father sent us His Son who left us a Church.

As you have seen from this and other threads here, the responses of many of those who think they don’t have to follow Church teaching is well below that of a well-behaved child.

Catherine makes a good point about the AB and his approach to the resolution of problems versus his role as teacher and pastor of the Catholic community. One, that others on this forum overlook. I am sure there are many other Catholic bishops in the country who have faced similar situations in their diocese and did not resort to the heavy handed tactics employed by AB Burke. Excommunications, failure to discuss differences with others before walking away like a child (Cardinal Glennon incident).

How many people did AB Burke excommunicate while he was in office? How many were excommunicated during the tenures of the last three ABs? That should tell you something about the effectiveness of Burke and his priorities.

He came here to let everyone know he was the new sheriff in town and he did his duty. He wanted to put the fear in his flock and he succeeded. Now he moves on to a new post. Good luck Burke, good luck church.

Matt, while I am able to understand your metaphor, I do not entirely agree with it. I don’t view excommunication as punishing them out of love. As Wikipedia graciously defines it: “Excommunication is a religious censure used to deprive or suspend membership in a religious community. The word literally means putting [someone] out of communion.”

Why did those who were excommunicated need to be taken out of the Catholic church in order to come to understand their faults and wrongdoings? Yes, it is important for them to understand if (and I am going to use the word if) they have done something wrong. But was excommunication really what needed to be done? Currently, the proof is saying otherwise, as Stanislaus seems to be completely unapologetic for what it has supposedly done wrong.

Finally, quite honestly, I wonder sometimes if the magisterium of the church needs to spend more time thinking through its own decisions and contemplating whether they just might in fact be wrong sometimes. It we are unwilling to at least question what is going on, then there will never be a chance to further improve our church and ourselves. I understand being able to admit to being wrong, but can there always be this line that is drawn for the church’s leadership so that we must always find ourselves willing to obey and either agree or, as ABBurke has been acting, get out? Is this the truth of what Christ taught? I don’t really know.

I think that ideally one’s parents should always truly know what is best for their children. In reality, this is unfortunately not as reliable a belief as one would hope. I believe there are times when the children can question and educate their parents, and rightly so. Perhaps the same is true of our church right now. After all, it is our church. It belongs to all of us, if you believe, Jesus’ gift to all people, not simply the magisterium.

Catherine, there are many women and men all over the world who are stunned and saddened by the recent actions of the representatives of the Catholic Church and the mean-spirited tone coming from the Vatican.
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/10/Take-Action-for-Sister-Louise
Just looking over the comments, you can see you are not alone in your dismay.
The recent edict against the ordination of women, the excommunications that followed, the censuring of Sr. Louise and the statements of the Vatican regarding the Anglican Church’s acceptance of women bishops all signal Catholics that things will never change. Women will remain second class citizens forever in the Catholic Church.
Right-wing Anglicans are moving over to the Catholic camp in droves. So what you are seeing is an already conservative church moving in an almost fascist fashion even farther to the right. There is very little fresh air left.
The question is to all who are concerned about this do you wish to remain and work for change or is it easier just to stop going. And to the traditionalist Catholics who are gloating, move over and make room for God’s Frozen Chosen. I hope all of you love cucumber sandwiches and sherry.

Mike and Matt

Where in Canon Law does it say to post KNOWN pedophilic priests in parishes WITHOUT telling the parents there that their children might be in danger ?

Anyone ever wonder what Jesus would think of all this? I suspect he’d have been censured by the likes of Burke, too. After all, Jesus ranted in the Temple when he got mad at what was going on there. He also had didn’t have “Mass” in the Church, but in an Upper Room–with sinners, even! (Gasp!)

Too bad Jesus did not have a Code of Canon Law to consult. If he had, He might have worn a Stole at the Last Supper.