Well at least he isn’t hiding the legalization of a mid-wife in a kickboxing bill this time. Though I do have one question, did your wife put you up to this so she can finally legally practice, not that the law has ever stopped her, she has her husband to protect her. You know you could become a real doctor who is trained and knows what they’re doing, that is one solution to this. Thinking of solutions, isn’t there more important things that we should be trying to do, I didn’t know the legalization of a mid-wife was important to the people of the St. Louis County. Oh, yea, I forgot, it only important to the Loudon’s who insist on breaking that law…

Just don’t make it legal for everyone to perform abortions again (while trying to make mid-wifing legal) John it’s all I ask.
Though if you do, I know a nice coat hanger trick I have been dieing to try out, because you did make that legal last time, remember!

What is that ‘coat hanger trick’?

Somehow, promoting the practice of unlicensed, untrained and unqualified persons delivering babies outside of a medical facility doesn’t seem consistent with the anti-choice agenda. Who’s looking out for the babies in all of this? What about junior’s right to swift and effective intervention in the event of complications?

Hello ”Earthtojohn.” What are you smoking?! Wife legally practice? Breaking the law? Huh?
Which side are you on anyway? The left and right both support this. The guy is giving everyone more choices. Tell me what is wrong about that. You must be either a fascist, doctors shill, or plain old Loudon hater?

Thank you Senator Loudon for continuing to support options for mothers and babies! Midwives are trained professionals in the areas of prenatal, labor, delivery, and postnatal care. Missouri is behind the times in this matter. If the public would take a little more time to educate themselves in the matters of homebirth and the midwifery model for care, they would find that it is a truly safe option for bringing children into this world. Women deserve a choice in the matter of who attends their labor and delivery. In this state it is a FELONY to attend to births as a midwife. Why? Why isn’t it up to the parents? This bill would allow for proper certification so that mothers can pick the best attendants at their labor. There is no reason this bill should not pass and our senators and representatives shouldn’t do their best to support families in the state of Missouri.

Thank you for the informative article about the midwifery bill currently being debated in the Senate. It is time for Missouri to license midwives who attend births in homes or birth centers. Your neighboring states have been doing this for a long time, in addition to many other states that license midwives.
This bill expands the options for birthing families in Missouri. There are families who are choosing home birth, and they need a qualified midwife to assist them. The bill will allow Certified Professional Midwives, who are exceptionally qualified to attend home births, to practice legally in Missouri as they do in most other states.
Your article illustrates that the midwifery proponents have been willing to compromise on the issues of major concern to the opponents. It is time now to stop the filibustering that is keeping the Senate from voting on the bill. The filibuster seems to be a highly undemocratic way of defeating a bill. Let them come forward and debate, rather than hiding behind the reading of the phone book type of maneuver. Senator Graham’s constituents should voice their outrage at his tactics. Let the bill be debated on its merits. To do less is to undermine the constitutional process. Sit down, Senator Graham. Let the Senators vote.

earthtojohn - you are sadly misinformed on this issue. Gina Loudon is a PhD, not a midwife, and has never had a homebirth. The Loudons are fighting for this issue because it is a matter of common sense and personal freedom, and they have the character to stand up for it despite the lack of special interest money behind it.

Also, I wanted to point out that I am from St. Louis County, the Loudon’s district, and this issue is of extreme importance to me and my family, and we are not alone.

whathappenedlasttime - when the word “abortion” appears in tocology literature, it is referring to the medical term of spontaneous abortion - aka miscarriage. But yes, you are right, anyone can have one…

Penelope - no one is talking about unlicensed, untrained, or unqualified persons. The bill specifically requires midwives to be certified by a nationally recognized board. And, if you had taken the time to read up on this issue, you would realize that home births with these midwives are as safe as, and depending on which statistics you’re examining, safer than, hospital births. 40 other states allow them, and with excellent results.

Please feel free to refer to the June 2005 British Medical Journal for a landmark study that compared hospital to homebirth results for the North American continent. If homebirths are so dangerous, why then is the World Health Organization pushing for more of them? This is the model of birth care widely used around the world in industrialized nations, which have much better birth statistics than the US.

Senator Loudon - thank you for your stand to give pregnant women a choice when it comes to how and when their babies are delivered. I hope Senator Graham will take an opportunity to educate himself on midwifery - he has absolutely no basis to claim this is a threat to public health. All evidence points to the contrary.

For Penelope,

I’d like to invite you to take just a moment to review the midwifery bill proposed….

What you would find if you did is that the midwives referenced would be licensed indeed by our state (not unlicensed) and would have demonstrated that they are in fact extremely qualified and well trained in out-of-hospital birth.
The midwives in question here are persons that have gone through rigorous training to meet all of the requirements necessary to earn the Certified Professional Midwife Credential after which becoming eligible to sit for the national exam set forth by the North American Registry of Midwives.
All steps must be completed successfully before any midwife can earn her internationally recognized credential.
Furthermore, a recent study published in the British Medical Journal found that for healthy women, a planned home birth with a Certified Professional Midwife is just as safe, and safer in many cases with a much less rate of unnecessary intervention, as a hospital birth with a physician. Yes, variables were controlled for.
And Penelope you ask, “Who is looking out for the babies…”
The babies’ parents are by choosing a birth provider and site that has been proven safe over and over again.
The midwives are by empowering families to be in charge of their healthcare.
The State of Missouri is by finally passing a law that allows midwives to help moms and babies when they need help. Without them, mothers travel to other states to give birth or stay at home alone when they might benefit from a midwife’s assistance.
Unlicensed? Clearly Not.
Untrained? Nope, wrong on that too.
Unqualified? Now, you are as far from the truth as it gets. Midwives are experts in out-of-hospital birth.

Senator Graham’s filibustering about midwifes again?!
This bill will make sure that they’re trained and licensed. I don’t see what Senator Graham’s beef with this whole issue is..
To say he’s standing up for public health is a joke.

Does he really think women aren’t intelligent decision makers?
Does he realize that mothers care far more about the safety of their babies than some bureaucrat in the state capitol?
Maybe not.
Apparently he thinks that his degree in journalism qualifies him to make healthcare decisions for the people of Missouri.
I don’t want him making any decisions for my wife.

This matter is deeply important to us, too, as residents and conscientious parents and citizens.

Thanks to Sen. Loudon for having the tenacity to stick with it!

Who’s looking out for the babies? Good question, it sure doesn’t seem to be Sen. Graham! He’s too busy looking out for the American Medical Association and its monopolistic grip on the big bucks of giving birth.

Last I checked, the U.S. as a whole came in 26th on the list of countries with low maternal and infant mortality and morbidity. That means you could go to 25 other countries to have a baby and come out with HEALTHIER moms and babies than the United States churns out….yet we’re somehow scared of breaking the medical industry’s hold on birth!

The country with the absolute best outcomes for mothers and babies is Holland, which utilizes a midwife-centered system for birth. If we were serious about protecting women and babies, instead of medical pocketbooks, we’d look around and institute best practices in our maternity care. Here in Missouri we’re not only behind the rest of the world, but we’re behind the rest of our own country….midwifery is gaining ground across the rest of the 50 states, while we’re one of the few backwards states adamantly outlawing and criminalizing maternity care that works.

Fear and ignorance surround pregnancy and birth, and women are expected to sit down, shut up, lift their feet into the stirrups and take it with good humor, grace and gratitude.

This bill introduces the idea of unleashing a whole new group of highly trained and licensed specialists into the field, one likely to cause even FEWER medical complications than we have now, saving the doctors’ expertise for those who truly need it.

It’s about time.

I know I appreciate John doing things the right way this time. We’ll see if he sticks to it or turns to “Tricks” as he put it

If this is such a good idea from a medical perspective, why would Loudon and the lobby be so opposed to it being regulated on the state level (which offers vastly more oversight than a license-and-cut-them-loose national program) by the State Board of Registration for the Healing Arts? Does your national accreditation board have effective disciplinary procedures or any investigative resources it can immediately deploy at the local level if there are complaints (read tragedies). The medical industry does have a handle on birth. The doctors who are going to have to clean up after the midwives are exactly the people who should be regulating them.

Penelope,

Again, you show your ignorance on this issue. Senator Loudon is not asking for anything that is different from what the other states who regulate midwifery do, and do extremely successfully. The safety mechanisms that the other states with legal midwives have in place are also in this bill.

To put the midwives under the SBRftHA is to put them under a board that is hostile to them. That’s like asking Democrats to be ruled by a board of Republicans, or vice versa. There is no public health safety issue here. It’s a red herring the medical lobby is using, a monopoly who simply does not want to give up its ineffective and disrespectful monopoly on birth in Missouri.

Penelope,
Go look up the bill for yourself.
Senator Loudon IS proposing a state board with regulation, just like any other medical profession. He just says that the members on the board should be members of the profession that they are regulating…. common sense - just like every other board.

The doctors are regulated by a state board of doctors.
The nurses are regulated by a state board made up of nurses.
The chiroprators are regulated by a state board made up of chiropractors.
The dentists are regulated by a state board made up of dentists.
The acupuncturists are regulated by a state board made up of acupuncturists.
The podiatrists are regulated by a state board made up of podiatrists.

The midwives should be regulated by a state board of MIDWIVES. This is exactly what Senator Loudon’s bill proposes. Maybe you should check the facts before speaking….

The doctors groups are pushing for the midwives to be regulated by the state board of doctors, the Board of Healing Arts.

The last time I checked, I found that there are no obstetricians currently on the State Board of Healing Arts.

Most of the docs on that board understand very little about birth - they are neurologists and other non-birth related fields. I highly doubt a single person on that entire board has ever witnessed a home birth. How on earth can we expect them to be able to understand the midwives and what their practices entail and how to regulate them fairly?

Not to mention that MDs often see midwives as competitors and would just as soon see them gone. There is no incentive for them to work with the midwives.

It nothing but another way to ensure that Missouri won’t have legal midwives practicing.

And I agree with Jennifer, it’s just like saying that the Democrats shall be policed by a board of Republicans.

I see, so you want to be regulated by people with less medical training than doctors. I still don’t hear you talking about babies. If you want to dress up in surgical masks and play doctor, why not practice in some other field of medicine at which you can develop some level of competence and which does not involve the innocent ones with so much to lose in all of this. Another regulating board? So this bill is both pro-choice and will increase taxes to pay for yet another licensing body? Doesn’t sound very republican to me.

hes not aloud to practice in missouri, im not wrong about that…

She****

And if there is one baby that enters this world and dies because it was delivered by a less qualified person, then its wrong to me… I’m sorry, dose your home have all the technology and support that a hospital has, i think not… And i don’t like the way he went tries to go about it either, sneaking in legislation into other bills and accidental using words that he didn’t understand the meaning of, oo look i just made it legal for EVERYONE to perform abortions, something is messed up about the Loudon’s’ and I’m not going to let that hurt the children.

People should have choices, you know, under that argument, I want to choose to do drugs that its more freedom and choices that I deserve, don’t I know what is absolutely safe after all I am 30, that makes all my choices right, right?
When a mistake can result in the death of an innocent child, then YES I DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH IT… And it is obvious that there is personal motive in this, and yes Johns wife is a mid-wife

Death of innocent children at home?
Has anyone considered the deaths of innocent children that occur in hospitals due to staph infections?
Medical errors due to understaffing?
Defensive medicine, just to ensure that nobody can get sued (doesn’t always equate with best choice for the patient[s])?

There are risks in the home and in the hospital, and people die of tragedies in both places.
All things being equal, though, the risk of having your baby die during or after birth in the hospital or at home are about the same.
Of course it would be for different reasons - in the hospital, because your nurse was caring for six laboring women, and didn’t notice something was seriously wrong, or because you were given an unnecessary C-section to ensure that if something went wrong the OB wouldn’t get sued.
At home it might be that your baby needed the NICU and immediate high risk care, and it was 20 minutes away. (Although usually those things are forseen ahead of time, by monitoring the baby’s heartrate.)
In the big picture, though, it doesn’t make the hospital safer, just means that there is a different set of risk factors for both locations/caregivers.

It’s also risky to strap your baby in the car and drive around town - there is risk of death to an innocent child. Maybe people should avoid going anywhere with children in their car whenever possible.

No, you use common sense, and you take steps to make it as safe as possible (like a car seat and being a safe driver) and then you hope that you don’t end up as one of the statistics.

People have good reasons for taking their kids to the zoo and navigating the risks of the street.

People also have good reasons for giving birth at home, and navigating the risks of not having extensive medical equipment at their fingertips.

Parents should get to decide if they want to take their kid to the zoo or birth at home.

[Sigh] Oh, Penelope, Penelope, why must you be so opinionated on a subject which you clearly have done NO research on?

This is ALL about the babies.

If a baby had the ability to speak, he would say he prefers to be born vaginally because it is better for his respiratory system and chance of survival. The US is approaching a 40-50% C-Section rate. Even the OBs admit this is alarming and unnecessary, not to mention dangerous.

Baby would also say he prefers to be born without pitocin because it stresses him in utero and deprives him of oxygen. Hospitals use pitocin on the vast majority of mothers.

After baby is born, he cries for his mother. Many hospital protocols ignore this important bonding time, instead subjecting baby to harsh evaluative procedures.

Penelope, please do some research on this subject before posting anymore ignorant assumptions, As you search for statistics showing your hypothesis that babies are at risk in home births, you will be surprised to find that they actually show the opposite.

What has never occurred to the earthtojohns and Penelopes of the anti-midwifery world is that the hospital technologies they think so necessary to birth actually interfere with birth and cause more risk. When a healthy, normal mother is left to labor unhindered she avoids all of the emergencies that the cascade of hospital interventions cause.

Did it ever occur to you that babies can and do die in hospitals? And because of the incompetency of doctors? Hundreds of babies died in the 90s because OBs decided it would be fun to use a non-FDA approved drug Cytotec for induction of labor, without disclosing risks to the mothers. It took a decade of dying mothers and babies for them to decide that perhaps this wasn’t such a good idea, yet, the drug is still in use in hospitals around the country, and still completely unapproved by the FDA for labor.

Please take a look at Holland, Japan, Australia, France, Germany, and many other industrialized nations around the world. These countries have been using the midwifery model of care that this bill represents for decades, and their mothers and babies are MUCH safer than American ones. Loudon’s bill just gives us the chance to choose a better system. Loudon’s bill is based in documented fact, not ignorant conjecture.

Penelope, please, I would appreciate it if you would take the time to do some research and come back with facts, rather than assumptions. Have fun looking. All the documentation and studies stand against you.

Ok,

All I can do is laugh. You obviously have NO idea what you are talking about. John’s wife a midwife? Do you know how to do research? I’m guessing not, but if you can figure it out, look up the records. All of her children were born in hospitals.

A midwife must be on call 24/7 for her clients. She has a full schedule of prenatal appointments. I guess she’s squeezing them in all of her free time while she runs for office?

Don’t know where you get your info, but you’re sadly mistaken.

I appreciate the Senator Loudon’s efforts to craft a rational bill which allows safe choices in childbirth. Home childbirth and childbirth at a birthcenter under the assistance of a trained midwife has proven to be some of the safest choices in childbirth.

However, midwives are not physicians and should not be regulated by boards of physicians. On the other hand, a trained midwife has attended over a hundred births before they finish their certification; therefore, they should be treated like the trained professionals they are and not criminalized.

As others have already pointed out, the medical industry has failed us for far too long. It is past time for Missouri to catch up with the rest of the Union and offer families safe alternatives to hospital childbirths.

Elisabeth

Certified Professional Midwives have far MORE training in natural birth than obstetricians or any other doctor.
Doctors are trained in treating problems. Midwives are trained in preventing and recognizing those problems.

The science shows that when women choose to give birth at home with a Certified Professional Midwife, the outcomes for babies and mothers is better than in hospitals with obstetricians.

Birth is not a medical procedure. Making it one results in more suffering for mothers and babies.

Maybe Penelope is just trying to make a point about how Loudon’s trickery is displayed in the matter of how he developed the bill and not so much about babies being born at home.

I appreciate Lee’s article on the currently debated midwifery bill. I hope that all Missourians will soon have legal options for choosing liscensed and qualified midwives for attending their births. Statistically, midwife-attended homebirths have much better outcomes than doctor-attended hospital births. This might sound incredulous to some people if they have not studied up on the issue, but it is verifiably true. Check out the Five Standards for Safe Child Bearing, by David Stewart, Ph.D. I certainly hope that the senators who are obviously filibustering in the name of “exploring the issue” will think of the rights of Missouri women, and the health and safety of our babies.

Others have commented on the proven safety of miwife attended births, so I will address this from a personal perspective . . . I am a St. Louis County resident and mother of two.

The birth of a baby is not a medical event. It is a rite of passage whose emotional aftermath - for better or for worse - colors the lives of both mother and baby forever. Although I am glad that OB’s, with their life-saving surgical skills, are available to those who need them, their monopoly on maternity care in this country has historically caused at least as many problems as it has solved. Even people who oppose a woman’s right to birth her babies at home cannot help but recognize that procedures such as inductions and C-sections are grossly overused, and by many doctors’ own admission are often performed due to the perceived spectre of malpractice litigation rather than due to any true necessity. These procedures have become so standard that their downside, both medical, emotional, and spiritual, are often conveniently overlooked. So what choices are moms left with if they want to avoid unnecessary interventions (and other proven risks of hospitalization such as MRSA)?

I have no political interest in the pending legislation whatsoever - in fact, I did not even know midwives still existed as a profession until well after I had my first baby. That birth was a standard hospital birth with an OB that ended in a C-section for no good reason other than lack of skilled labor management and the classic “cascade of interventions”. My second was a completely hands-off, wonderful, peaceful birth in the comfort of familiar surroundings. The shocking contrast between these two experiences has motivated me to get the message out to my peers whenever I have a chance that they do indeed have the right to insist on receiving skilled, woman-centered maternity care, and that most MD’s, surprisingly enough, are not qualified to provide this. With the labor intervention rate well over 90% in most hospitals, most medical residents rarely get to SEE a baby born the way Nature intended, let alone learn the skills necessary to gently help out Mom and baby if they hit a road bump along the way. Obstetricians’ skill sets are limited to reaching for either the drugs or the scalpel, necessarily turning many minor difficulties into major emergencies.

I have had two easy pregnancies, but after my first birth, I could not even hold the baby because I was shaking too badly from the anaesthesia, and the emotional devastation of being “absent” from his first moments on this earth haunts me to this day. With my second, the baby did not cry when she was born, just looked around her in wonder . . . her first “sleep smile” was just hours after she arrived. Midwives should not just be legalized - they should be the “standard of care”, leaving OB’s to manage the high-risk cases they are trained for.

Thank you, Senator Loudon, for trying to bring Missouri into at least the late 20th century. This state is so ridden with antiquated laws and dangerous thinking about its citizens healthcare, it is reminiscent of the pocket-lining so prominent in the deep South. Mr Loudon is likely the FIRST and ONLY politician I have met here that is actually pushing legislation for the interest of the people he serves and NOT companies lining his pockets! Imagine that! A Senator that comes to small events and looks you in the eye when he shakes your hand and listens to your story. One who fights for what is right and not what will fit right in his pocket.

Also, thank you to the writer who took time to cover the article. I moved here from one of those famed states where midwifery without a nursing degree is legalized, safe & certified and had a really hard time trying to find a midwife here that would help me with even a hospital birth, never mind a homebirth! There is no voodoo or witch-doctor aspect to midwifery, it is the centuries-old art of assisting a mother birthing her child. An obstetrician is a surgically-trained specialist in maternal health needed when complications arise, going to one for a routine pregnancy is akin to going to a cardiologist for elevated cholesterol. Why would the latter be considered a waste of resources yet not the first? It is a basic human right to select our providers for our healthcare, and needs to stay that way. This whole issue is not whether midwifery is right/better, but that we have choices and we will not allow our state government to take CHOICES away from us because they want money from big business. If you can’t stand up for this today, turn around and apologize to your children, nephew, nieces, and grandchildren for not caring enough to secure THEIR rights and choices.

I am so glad that Senator Loudon is still willing to go to bat for Missouri’s mothers an newborns, despite all the grief the issue has caused him!

We recently moved from Missouri to Silicon Valley for my husband’s work. I had my first child last spring in a Missouri hospital. She was supposed to be born at home with one of the few midwives MO has–ladies that are brave enough to help birthing families, despite the personal risks. However I was in a wreck, and my little girl was born a month early–just the sort of emergency situation that is NOT appropriate for homebirth–so I didn’t have one. I had a reasonably natural birth, despite being in the hospital, but largely because I am a stubborn person. Because of the current legal situation our midwives are in, even though I had excellent prenatal care, I could not give the hospital access to my prenatal records, or even safely tell them my midwife’s name.

Midwifery care is the gold standard in countries that have MUCH better outcomes for mothers and newborns than the USA does. Midwives are trained in how to help with normal pregnancy and childbirth. Obstetricians are NOT trained in this. They are trained in what to do in complicated, emergency, and high-risk pregnancies and childbirths. I am nearsighted, but don’t have any other eye problems. When I need a new contact lens prescription, I don’t go to an eye surgeon, or generally even an opthamologist. The care I need is most appropriately provided by an optician–a specialist in normal, everyday, eye issues. So that’s where I go.

I am expecting my second child in October. In California, midwives are legal. They have been legal for many years. They are listed in the yellow pages. They are able to order lab tests. They are NOT able to prescribe medicine or do abortions, but if you do need to see a doctor for a pregnancy complication, one of the more involved tests, or a prescription, your midwife and your doctor can work together to give you the best possible care. If you do need to transfer to the hospital during labor, your midwife can accompany you without risking arrest–and she will be treated by hospital staff as what she is–a specialist in her field. California has had legal midwives since before the Certified Professional Midwife credential that is in the Missouri bill existed, so they had to go to the trouble of setting up their own credentialing system–but the two are close enough that most of the midwives in this area have both the California “Licensed Midwife” credential and the national “Certified Professional Midwife” credential Missouri should be using. My baby, barring wrecks or other emergencies, will be born at home this fall with the assistance of a skilled, credentialed, LEGAL midwife who does not have to risk her very _freedom_ to practice her calling.

The situation in Missouri is nothing short of criminal. Especially in a very rural state, it is quite likely that the lack of skilled, home-centered, midwife-based prenatal and childbirth care costs lives every year. Midwives care for women and babies in their homes. They take on fewer patients at once, so they can be available to each family 24/7–and will actually be with the family all through labor and delivery. Contrast this with an OB, who is only available during office hours, who won’t even guarantee to be there when your baby is born, does not make house calls, and whose office, in some parts of MO, might be over 50 miles away, in the town where the hospital also is. Anyone with a brain can see that this is a bad situation from the outset. And that’s before you even get to the inappropriate actions often taken simply because an obstetrician is not the appropriate specialist for a normal, pregnancy, labor, and birth.

I’m not sure what more can be said on this issue than what has already been defended by comments 5-10. I agree with every one of them 100%. And I think it is a sad day when a Senator who is supposed to be representing the people of this state is willing to allow money and unfounded scare tactics to prevent the vote of the majority. I resent being “dumbed down” to as a woman and a mother, as if I cannot possibly know what is best for me and my baby. I should not be forced to have someone with “impaired” judgement choosing where and with whom I have my baby. I can do the research, thank you very much.

I’m not sure what else can be said other than what has already been defended by Ida, Jennifer, and Allison. I agree with them 100%. It is a sad day in Missouri when a senator, who is supposed to be representing the will of the people, will allow money and unfounded scare tactics to prevent the majority vote. Also, I resent being “dumbed down to” as a woman and mother, as if I cannot make an informed decision about what is best for my family. Should I allow someone with “impaired judgement” to dictate how and where and with whom I can have my baby? I can do the research for myself, thank you very much!

Home birth, home school, self service legal forms…. What will you people want next? Individual rights and liberty? You’re tromping on sacred ground when you mess with the AMA, NEA, and ABA. Just who do you think you are, anyway?

I have heard allot on this issue, the rights of the mother, the rights of the baby. I have read about how horrible our hospitals are and how they are not as good as mid-wives, I have read about Johns messed up legalization of abortion while trying to make mid-wife legal. Well from a personal note, I used to be a family friend of the Loudons and personal reason have changed that. In fact my personal experience tells me that John and Gina are working for their own views not those of whom he represents. If it happens to coincide that’s great! But Gina is not a good person when it comes to this topic, she INFACT DOSE disregarded the law to mid-wife. John and I had a falling out after he accidentally legalized more then he knew, and he got it from his daughters spelling book? that’s who i want writing my bills. He is working for the views of the few. If your experience at a hospital get a new doctor, because my wives experiences were wonderful in a hospital and i would never change that. You have options when it comes to birth already, I don’t want a dangerous MID-WIFE bill to be passed because of the negative effect it could have on our CHILDRENS BIRTH… Something tells me that THIS IS WRONG, and its by personal experience that tells me so. That’s all I know, think what you want but they will never have my vote again.

Pass the bill, doctors dont like it and they have to certify people. there not going to be legally ablidged to cirtify anyone, and mid-wifes will be legal, but ther wont be any! Shuts both sides up, its a poorly written bill, but hey, leave it to the Doc, they shut it down!

Here is my logic, piss the docs off, don’t get quality care when i need it. There for, I’m all for making the trained professionals do every they are trained to do, I wont make them mad because I need them to much.. though Loudon’s cant find a doctor in the state of Missouri, why is that?

Many have already provided the multitude of reasons for this bill. I just wanted to say that I rarely agree with anything that Senator Loudon does. However, I support him on this midwifery bill and am glad he has championed the cause. I was very critical of how he went about it in the last session, one because it was devious politically but two, because that deviousness got thrown onto midwifery. But, that was last year and this is now.
The time has come to pass this legislation.

I’m sure I could find statistics on the internet and elsewhere that would both substantiate and repudiate (depending on what I was looking to do) everything that has been posted here about the safety of birthing those young ‘ens at home. The fact of the matter is, there are myriad variables in play in any home birth situation, and no study or group of statistics is going to control for even the most important ones. You take several important checks on one’s competency to safely attend a birth, as well as checks on the safety of the surroundings, out of play when you allow private individuals to choose someone to come into a private home to facilitate the birth of a baby. At least when you go to a hospital, you know the place is maintained to regulated health and safety standards and you know that the person assisting you - not to mention the group of professionals that are there assisting him or her - have all been extended to privilege to practice there.

I am a member of an already licensed and regulated profession in this state, so I’m not looking for anyone to legalize what I do. You should consider that in formulating the rhetoric in these postings. If you want respect, try to be nice. For bonus points, refrain from using the word “ignorant” or any of its derivations.

IC, you can only be lying for claiming to be a friend of the Loudons. Two reasons: only a liar could claim to be a friend and also hold that Gina is a midwife. Certainly a friend would know better. Secondly, you are nearly illiterate and I am pretty sure the Loudons generally associate with people who can write. At least you have “HAHA” to make you look bright.

On abortion: This bill is not about legalizing abortions, that is already legal in Missouri. Certified Professional Midwives are caretakers of BIRTH in out of hospital settings, not abortion. Two distinctly different issues. Nowhere in any legalization efforts in all of the history of midwifery here in Missouri was the abortion procedure included. Totally different subject.

On training: The NARM process for certification is (I assure you since I”M in the process of it) very lengthy, thorough and challenging. This is not a 6 week class or a mail-order “degree”. This is a legitimate educational path to professional midwifery. One, by the way, that the Missouri Department of Secondary Education legitimizes and provides funds for students pursuing it. Don’t trust “internet mail-order schools”. Fine. But I think everyone trusts DESE to determine if a school/edication is worth funding. And they do. They are. As of TODAY. To say that the CPM credential is “underqualified” is like saying EMT’s are “low-class doctor-wanna-be’s”. I think not.

On our dear Sen. Graham: Politics at best. Or worst. Filibustering, big-money, distorting and withholding the truth from his constituents and the entire state of Missouri… politics. Don’t forget Sen. Graham, you intend to run for a state-wide office this fall. Trust me, your behavior in this very-important midwifery issue is not going to be forgotten come poll-time. We are all watching, and hoping you will be a man of honor and uphold the integrity of your office. The people have spoken. The statistics support them. Other states license CPM’s with WONDERFUL success as well as saving tax-payer money… Stop listening to the money Sen. Graham. Please.

Penelope–
The term “ignorant” can be used as a descriptive term as well as as a perjorative term. In its descriptive mode, “ignorant” means “one who has not apprised themselves of the facts relating to a situation”. I, for example, know a fair amount about the midwifery issue and the politics surrounding it in Missouri, through much study and several years of helping with the effort to make Missouri’s midwives legal. I am, however, thoroughly ignorant of almost everything relating to the actual writing of a computer program in the C programming language–even though my husband is an expert and it’s what puts food on our table. You admit, in your last post, that you have NOT, indeed, informed yourself about the issue upon which you are commenting. By definition and your own admission, you are ignorant of the particulars surrounding the midwifery issue in Missouri. This being the case, those who have replied to you have been QUITE respectful. They have merely requested that you make informed comments.

As to the safety of the birthing environment, both home and hospital have their problems. Homes lack the equipment to do an emergency C-section (meaning a woman who needs one has to transport to the hospital), although midwives do carry equipment to do such things as resuscitate a baby or stop a postpartum hemmorhage. Hospitals, even ones “maintained to regulated health and safety standards”, come with problems such as nearly endemic MRSA (and other hospital-borne infections, such as my baby caught), and, if anything, too much equipment, etc, which brings the temptation to use it when the evidence-based proper approach is hands-off. This leads to such things as our current 30%+ C-section rate–when the World Health Organization and actual evidence-based practice recommend about a 15% C-section rate as being representative of optimal care of mothers and newborns.

I no longer have a personal dog in this fight, as I left MO in October, but I am rooting for MO to finally give its birthing families the privilege of the option to choose the birthing method that is best for each family.

Penelope,

I apologize if I offended you. Heather summarizes well my intended use of the word in question.

Since you seem unwilling to inform yourself on this issue, I am happy to provide you with a study, published in the British Medical Journal in 2005, which analyzed ALL home births involving certified professional midwives across the United States (98% of cohort) and Canada in 2000. Please note that the midwives in this study are exactly the midwives we hope to legalize in Missouri, and yes, while it might be difficult to control for variables in many studies of this nature, that difficulty is certainly removed when the referenced study group includes the entire population.
http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/330/7505/1416

By the way, I am not a midwife or a lobbyist. I’m just a suburban stay-at-home mom (in Senator Loudon’s district) who could not ignore the evidence supporting home birth, and who believes I should have the right to make the best, evidence-based, health care choices for my children.

I am grateful to be represented by a legislator who has the character to stand up for me.

Penelope no worries the above quote is from John and his Merry Band of Midwives… These people are as fanatical as him. There is no use using logic upon them they are impervious. I’d prefer to listen to actual doctors not midwives or Ms. Loudon.

Note: Earthtojohn- She’s not a medical doctor.

For those of you who “prefer to listen to actual doctors,” I invite you (for the third time) to refer to the article I linked above from the British MEDICAL Journal.

I have experienced both a hospital and home birth in IL before moving to MO. The home births were far safer for me and my babies with far less complications and expense. It is ridiculous that MO does not allow mothers to choose which type of birth they wish for their own safety and that of their babies. How can Sen Graham claim to be a womens’ rights supporter and not support this bill? This bill is all about a woman’s right to choose and I applaud Sen Loudon for supporting it in the face of tremendous opposition. Thank you for writing this article to get the word out about this very important issue for MO women.

IC- I have a few comments in response to your post. Sen. Loudon is working for more than just the views of a “few”. There are so many homebirth families all over this state wishing and waiting for their freedom to choose where and with whom to birth their babies. Even if he was working for just a few, it’s still an important issue considering MO is the ONLY state in the nation where this is a felony!
It’s not that easy to just “get a new doctor” if you have an issue at the hospital. Truth be told, it doesn’t much matter what a woman’s dr tells her during her pregnancy about what she can have for her birth. They’ll find something to force things to go their way. The staff are the ones who strap you down, shoot up your arm, and make you at their mercy to the hospital’s protocols around here. Usually the doctor is just on the phone and comes to catch the baby. If you want options in the hospital you have to FIGHT for them. Birth should not have to be a fight with the parents on guard from the moment they step foot in the hospital. They have enough to be concerned about with their child coming into this world. That’s why women are flocking to homebirth. There’s as revolution going on. Home is more comfortable & just as safe. I want this option LEGAL for my daughters.
I’m glad your wife had a good experience in the hospital. I didn’t, many women I know didn’t. That’s why we want a legal choice. You don’t have to be worried about someone forcing your wife to homebirth. We’re the ones being forced to the hospital in this state!