dougmla
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Post subject: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 11:32 am
I wasn't sure.
Obviously, we offer arbitration to Holliday and DeRosa.
I know we get 2 picks with Holliday, is DeRosa Type A or Type B?
Also what about Piniero, and Glaus? Are either of them consider Type A or B free agents? Would it be wise/worthwhile to offer them arb. so to get some replacement picks?
ChrisH
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 11:35 am
dougmla wrote
I wasn't sure.
Obviously, we offer arbitration to Holliday and DeRosa.
I know we get 2 picks with Holliday, is DeRosa Type A or Type B?
Also what about Piniero, and Glaus? Are either of them consider Type A or B free agents? Would it be wise/worthwhile to offer them arb. so to get some replacement picks?
There was an article this morning that directly answers your questions.
http://www.stltoday.com/blogzone/commishs-hot-stove/commishs-hot-stove/2009/11/holliday-six-other-cardinals-file-for-free-agency/
Holliday will get arb, DeRosa not guaranteed but possible.
Pineiro is unlikely, Glaus all but impossible.
Holliday is the only Type A, others are all Type B.
B_Ruby
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 11:42 am
MLB Rules and Procedures
Compensation for Teams Whose Free Agents Sign Elsewhere
http://www.sonsofsamhorn.net/wiki/index.php/MLB_Rules_and_Procedures#Compensation_for_Teams_Whose_Free_Agents_Sign_Elsewhere
The 2006 CBA changed the draft pick compensation for free agents substantially. The current compensation system is as follows:
If a free agent is offered arbitration by Team 1 and instead signs with Team 2, then Team 1 may receive some form of compensation. The compensation is determined by the player's Elias Rating, a statistical measure of his value tabulated by the Elias Sports Bureau. Free agents are categorized as Type A, Type B, or unrated, and are then ranked within these three categories.
If the free agent is Type B, Team 1 receives what is known as a "sandwich pick" in the following year's amateur player draft. After round 1 (30 selections) in the draft, Team 1 will receive an extra pick. (For more info on sandwich picks, please see the section on the amateur draft.)
If the free agent is Type A, then:
* If Team 2 has one of the last fifteen draft picks in round 1, Team 1 will receive Team 2's first round draft pick and a sandwich pick after the first round of the draft.
* If Team 2 has one of the first fifteen draft picks in round 1, that pick is protected, and Team 1 would instead receive Team 2's second round pick and a sandwich pick after the first round of the draft.
* If Team 2 signs two Type A free agents, one from Team 1 and one from another team, the team whose free agent ranks highest by major league baseball would receive Team 2's first round pick (or second round pick if the first round pick is protected), and the other team would receive Team 2's pick for the second round (or third round if the first pick is protected). Both teams would still receive a sandwich pick after the first round.
* Once a team has acquired a draft pick by losing a Type A free agent, it cannot lose said pick by signing other Type A free agents; the only picks a team may lose are the ones which it had before the free agency period began.
Last edited by B_Ruby on 09 Nov 2009 12:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
wibb77
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 11:42 am
I've always wondered who makes these determinations-Type A, Type B, or other. Didn't Pineiro win 15 games this year? Wouldn't that classify him a Type A. Can someone explain this to me, please?
B_Ruby
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 11:48 am
2010 Free Agents MLB: Complete List of Major League Free Agents
http://www.nowpublic.com/sports/2010-free-agents-mlb-complete-list-major-league-free-agents-2510371.html
"The 2010 MLB free agent list includes projected Type A and Type B free agents. Current free agents who have not yet signed are not on this list. The 2010 MLB free agent list is updated as of Nov. 5, 2009."
According to the above link, Joel Pineiro is a Type B free agent.
B_Ruby
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 12:01 pm
wibb77 wrote
I've always wondered who makes these determinations-Type A, Type B, or other. Didn't Pineiro win 15 games this year? Wouldn't that classify him a Type A. Can someone explain this to me, please?
"The compensation is determined by the player's Elias Rating, a statistical measure of his value tabulated by the Elias Sports Bureau. Free agents are categorized as Type A, Type B, or unrated, and are then ranked within these three categories."
jjray
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 12:02 pm
ChrisH wrote
They should offer Pineiro arb. This is likely his last shot at a big contract and he will not take arb. It makes sense to offer DeRosa because he is coming off a down year. If they did offer JP and DeRosa and neither accepted (then signed elsewhere), here is how it breaks down.
1 first **
3 sandwich pics between 1st and 2nd round
** Caveat: if team signing Holliday has one of first 15 picks in the first round, that pick is protected and we get that teams 2nd round pick instead.
UncleBuck45
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Joined: 01 Apr 2009
Posts: 1895
Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 12:05 pm
ChrisH wrote
dougmla wrote
I wasn't sure.
Obviously, we offer arbitration to Holliday and DeRosa.
I know we get 2 picks with Holliday, is DeRosa Type A or Type B?
Also what about Piniero, and Glaus? Are either of them consider Type A or B free agents? Would it be wise/worthwhile to offer them arb. so to get some replacement picks?
There was an article this morning that directly answers your questions.
http://www.stltoday.com/blogzone/commishs-hot-stove/commishs-hot-stove/2009/11/holliday-six-other-cardinals-file-for-free-agency/
Holliday will get arb, DeRosa not guaranteed but possible.
Pineiro is unlikely, Glaus all but impossible.
Holliday is the only Type A, others are all Type B.
Pineiro should definitely receive an arbitration offer. I'd bet that the Cardinals would like to have Pinero back for 1 year at like 7 million and I'm sure Pineiro wants to cash in big time on his great season.
I'd be very very very surprised if Pineiro doesn't try to get a 3-4 year deal out of his 15 win, 3.49 ERA season. He won't come close to those numbers again.
Pondo7
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Joined: 09 Oct 2009
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 12:13 pm
If we got better picks from the teams who pick up our FAs, would it be possible to trade away our picks in hopes of getting an established player? like if our first round pick is 27 and we get the #16 pick
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Bottenfield
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 12:19 pm
Pondo7 wrote
If we got better picks from the teams who pick up our FAs, would it be possible to trade away our picks in hopes of getting an established player? like if our first round pick is 27 and we get the #16 pick
No trading draft picks.
Picklefork
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 12:20 pm
Holliday and Pineiro should be no-brainers for the Cards. Joel is almost surely going to want and get a multi year contract, so the Cards are in a win/win situation with him b/c as previously stated having him back isnt the problem, its the length of the deal that is the problem.
I also think DeRosa should be a no-brainer, but I can see why the Cards wouldnt. I do think offering him arb is a nice way to insulate themselves for when he leaves for CHI or Philly and if Perez and Todd turn out to be something then they at least have something to show for it other then no playoff wins and a bad wrist.
Cards should gamble a bit and offer all 3 arb....live a lil bit, odds are all 3 are gone by X-Mas anyway.
PS...if a team signs DeRosa or the other 2 before the arb date, usually the first week in DEC, the Cards automatically get the draft pick b/c the arb offer is assumed.
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B_Ruby
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Post subject: Re: Can anyone tell me what draft picks we'll get?
Posted: 09 Nov 2009 12:20 pm
dougmla wrote
Also what about Piniero, and Glaus? Are either of them consider Type A or B free agents? Would it be wise/worthwhile to offer them arb. so to get some replacement picks?
Re: offering Glaus arbitration
The Cards learned an expensive lesson after the 1991 season, when they had no intention of signing aging Pedro Guerrero to a contract, but offered him arbitration just so they could get a draft pick because they expected Guerrero to sign elsewhere. Then the Cards made it known Guerrero didn't have a job, as St. Louis made a trade on Nov. 25 to acquire 1B Anders Gallaraga from Montreal. (Pedro's knees pretty much prevented him from playing anywhere but 1B.)
Much to their shock, when Pedro didn't get any significant offers right away, his agent notified the Cardinals they were accepting arbitration.
And then the Cards were on the hook to pay Guerrero the highest salary of his career, $2,425,000, a huge sum on the Cardinal payroll at the time, especially for a guy who was probably going to be a pinch-hitter.
That move hurt the Cardinals budget and their chances of acquiring a free agent pitcher, which they were trying to do at the time. When Guerrero accepted arbitration, it left St. Louis with less cash in their budget to go after other needs.
